Provis in the attic

In which Collin describes grand vertical adventuring. Brandon celebrates LR’s win. And Pip puts out a fire.

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A VERY ROUGH TRANSCRIPT OF THE EPISODE

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SUMMARY KEYWORDS

rock climbing, 90 degree weather, old house, rock wall, climbing instructor, sports betting, Pete Rose, Missouri State, basketball championship, parent teacher conferences, volleyball game, Miss Havisham, Estella, Pip, Jaggers, Jaggers character, moral perspective, personal revelation, Estella's parentage, secret keeping, emotional conflict, narrative pacing, character connections, story resolution, Joe Gargery, Orlick, Pumblechook, haiku, book discussion.

SPEAKERS

Brandon, Collin Funkhouser

Collin Funkhouser  00:00

Hey. Welcome to Oh brother, a podcast where we try to figure it all out with your hosts, Brandon and Collin on this week's show, Provis in the attic, ahoy. Ahoy. How's it going?

Brandon  00:21

Boy. How's it going there? Well, it was fine. My microphone was not close enough to me because the the Zoom meeting joined first time. No problems this time. And I was not expecting that. So I

Collin Funkhouser  00:35

was, you're waiting, you're waiting

Brandon  00:38

for like it did not listen and be problematic, and it was like being done. Welcome, who knows, who knows. So I was caught slightly off guard, but Hello. How are you?

Collin Funkhouser  00:53

Oh, surprise. It worked. It worked, people, I know that's what the internet companies never want you to know is that it's supposed to work. Sometimes you guessing. Indeed I am well, I am not enjoying this 90 degree weather.

Brandon  01:14

Oh, gosh, it's so this is nuts. All right, just so. So listeners, posterity reasons, I need you to know that Monday, it the feels like temperature was negative one, yes, okay, I was, that's the contextual. My actual temperature was like 15 degrees, but maybe like 17, right? It was my actual temperature, okay, today, less five days later. Six days later is 90 degrees

Collin Funkhouser  01:47

90, and it's like it was like, it was like a beefy 92 it wasn't just like a, Oh, whatever. No. It was

Brandon  01:55

like a, it was like a, oh, my god.

Collin Funkhouser  01:58

Welcome to August. Kind of 90 stuff. No,

Brandon  02:04

horrid, like, oh yeah, no, it

Collin Funkhouser  02:07

was, it was, it's been bad. And I'm not ready for that. My house isn't ready for it. I can tell my house isn't. So again, CFO mentioned old house, okay, it's very important that we recognize that my house is, it's not the oldest one of my friends, but I have 106 year old home. Okay, so, like, just start there. It doesn't handle these kind of transitions really well downstairs. Okay, I'm looking

Brandon  02:31

crazy, making like, lots of exciting noises. Okay, tracks like

Collin Funkhouser  02:38

we left, and it goes into this thing called a vacation mode, because I'm in a remote location ramp, and my downstairs is 74 degrees. Upstairs is 83

Collin Funkhouser  02:56

and eventually, throughout the summer, though, it regulates a little bit better, but it was, yeah, but, like, not ready for that.

Brandon  03:04

Like, hardcore. It was just, it was the heater was working overtime six scant days ago.

Collin Funkhouser  03:11

Like, I'm sorry, you want What do

Brandon  03:16

you mean? The air is just blasting? What's going on?

Collin Funkhouser  03:20

Yes, yeah. So it's trying, it's the it's trying. It's widdle, bitty, heart out, trying, really trying. It's okay. It's okay. Oh dear. So yes, we are, we are we are surviving the heat and schweizen, whatever, and doing well, doing well, have I have I told you that my my children are heavily involved in rock climbing these days.

Brandon  03:52

I got a picture of children rock climbing. Yes, there was really no context with the picture. I think you said, like, I don't even know if you typed anything with the picture. Oh, I

Collin Funkhouser  04:03

just said on the wall today because,

Brandon  04:05

oh yeah. Like there was no other context about this. Some children on a rock wall.

Collin Funkhouser  04:16

So the there's a college campus 45 minutes from where we live, and it they have this rock wall, and it's not like a rock climbing gym, like I'm used to from Petra in Springfield, where, when you say

Brandon  04:32

used to, like, I mean, I was

Collin Funkhouser  04:35

a long time ago Collin that I know. It's not, it's not what I know. Okay, yeah, all my days.

Brandon  04:41

It's not Yeah, it's not a thing that I did with my days. Those days were 30 years ago.

Collin Funkhouser  04:53

Somewhere between, maybe they were, they were,

Brandon  04:55

they were definitely 20 years

Collin Funkhouser  04:57

ago, yes. So that's that that was. What I was used to, and was I was expecting of, like giant building, and all of the walls have places to climb and adhere yourself to the wall. And that's not what this is. It's one of it's more modern in that, in that it is a column, a freestanding column that goes two stories, and you can climb all around it, like it's that kind of thing. And they Jeff, the climbing instructor, who has been he was hired by the university to be their climbing instructor and to run this. And so he puts together lots of programs and does education and teaches classes on climbing and etc. And they do outdoor climbing too, so he's an instructor for that. And he was tasked with kind of so they have a I learned this because I like talking to people who are either a passionate or B, really good, like experts at what they do, and it's a plus if it's both. So while the kids were resting, I was like, Jeff, I need to talk to you like, right now. What's going on? And I and, oh, sorry, hold on. Okay, sorry. And so I was like, hey, like, we like, I want to know more about this. Tell me, like, what you do. And so he was explaining this, apparently, they have, like, a non compete with the town's activity center because they all offer the same thing. So they can't accept, like, paid membership to have access to their gymnasium and their stuff there on campus. However, they has a rock wall right like, and so they can take paying members to access the rock wall. And so he was tasked with, like, getting more rock walling people. So he's put up this program, and he's now, like, doing teaching and education and things like that. And so I was like, just listening to him talk and kind of how he approaches stuff. It's fantastic. It's phenomenal. So he's, he actually has been, you know, he lets him free climb, but then, you know, he'll be like, Hey, why don't you try only touching black, right? Because they have the black line, and then they'll have the yellow court, you know, trek that you're supposed to take, and things like that. And I was like, yes, like all of the challenge. Please do all of the challenge. I absolutely love it. And so that's been really good, and we've been enjoying that quite a lot. They've been going twice a week, and it's been, I don't know, it's just one of those things of like, I remember, I mean, I'm so terrified of heights. Yes, I remember that for sure, still am. So I don't know, just like, seeing them go and like, just like, just do it, you know, they're just like, boom, up and down and back down. And I'm like, yeah, there you go. So that would be amazing, yes. So we've been, we've been enjoying this. It's been a nice little kind of respite, respite from everything else going on, for sure.

Brandon  08:47

Well, nice, you go, Yes, Grand vertical adventure, I was wondering, yeah, like, I don't know. Like, it was already sort of a niche thing anyway, and I don't really know how much the sport of climbing has grown or not in 20 years since I've seen a climbing gym, right? So, like, yeah, it was much more versatile, right? A full giant building, because they have, like, different routes and like, a whole bouldering like section and things like this. But, I mean, if there's different routes and stuff on and pillar that works too, I just didn't know how it was set it up, and I was just kind of thinking about, like, that was interesting, and how does is climbing growing? Is it not growing? I don't know, Central Missouri is hard because, like, where you're gonna climb, like, what mountain like, what like, a little flat area?

Collin Funkhouser  09:50

Yeah, they travel to, like, some of the more upheaval zones in central Missouri and like, like Columbia and. Jeff City and kind of like that world, apparently,

Brandon  10:03

yeah, there's, like, some small they're like, bluffy things, right?

Collin Funkhouser  10:07

Yes, it's more bluffy things, yes. But he was apparently, like, his classes are full. Obviously, the show freeze, or the movie free solo has done this for sure, piqued a lot of interest to people. And I think that's, you know, where they're trying to why they have this position, actually, is like, hey, let's do this. There's more interest here. Let's make more interest, like people. Make people more known, known about this. You can join the club if you want to. It was, he was telling me, like, they do some of the more advanced, like rescue and recovery techniques. Because he like, I would never have thought about this. Like, okay, where do you practice recovery techniques that are designed for you when you're 1000 feet up on a cliff, right?

Brandon  11:05

Like, that's true when you have no 1000 foot cliffs, yeah,

Collin Funkhouser  11:09

how do you or like, a small cliff? No, what they do is they, they, they take over a basketball court, and they do it standing up and walking backwards, so that they can get get this right. Someone is pulling it and they so they can practice the movements in in, like, normal gravity, and so when, so

Brandon  11:37

they're just Okay, so they just have to think about being vertical, like, that's

Collin Funkhouser  11:42

where they start. They start there. They lay everything out, and then they kind of go back, go backwards, walk backwards, and move, do movements and stuff like that. Then they put

Brandon  11:50

them on. When you say walk backwards, do you mean like, are we practicing belaying, like, like, repelling? Is that

Collin Funkhouser  11:56

what's happening here? Okay. So imagine also No, no, no.

Brandon  12:00

Like, okay. So when you say walk backwards, that's the vision that I have. It's like, okay, sorry, they're imagining going down

Collin Funkhouser  12:07

from going down, yes, yes. Also, like the scenario he set up of like, hey, there's, there's a way to climb. Let's say you have 200 feet of rope, and that's all you have. You can use that to scale an 800 foot cliff. Yes, then he was like, but what happens if 400 feet up you run into trouble and have to go back down? Like, so it's, it's the process of, like, reversing everything and like, and like, oh, how do I carry someone with me? How do I tie those knots? So they always start just on flat ground, and I know, I know. And then they add little bits of feetage above, you know. And that's been, I don't know. I was just like, wow. I had no idea. Because I you just, you never think about, I just, I would never have thought that you would just go to a basketball court and go practice some stuff.

Brandon  13:07

I would have also never thought that. So fair enough, right?

Collin Funkhouser  13:12

I know. So that's, uh, yeah, that was, that was my Monday of getting talk with good old Jeff about climbing. He's been doing this for 20 years. His climbing partner has been doing this since the 80s. And so that's they go out and they do crazy stuff, basically. So basically is what they do. We go,

Speaker 1  13:41

I'm trying to think of other rock climbing movies. And I got like the rainbow one, and then the one with

Brandon  13:53

Chris O'Donnell has seen that one. The like the one where they cut off the person at the beginning and they fall down. It's very dramatic, right? What is that one called? Let's see again, random, Googling things live. What's what we do, right? What is it? What is that movie? I can never remember the name of this stinky movie.

Speaker 1  14:25

Yes, yes, yes. Maybe I shouldn't have put like, real rock climb movies.

Collin Funkhouser  14:32

Yeah, you're probably

Brandon  14:35

there's the RAMBo one, right? Yeah, right, with the Sylvester Stallone. And then there's the one, is it? Vertical Limit is that the name in that movie.

Speaker 1  14:45

Vertical Limit is that the name is that? What it is,

Collin Funkhouser  14:49

I don't, I don't

Brandon  14:50

know this one. Oh, it is, yeah. Oh, you don't know this one, yeah, of course. Oh, it has no Paxton. You go, yeah, bang. There you go. Look at that

Collin Funkhouser  15:05

on Netflix and everything. Okay,

Brandon  15:09

that's the other, I can only think of three movies. So there you go. There's the top three lists, because I only have three

Collin Funkhouser  15:18

can't do anymore.

Speaker 1  15:20

Literally, could not that's all,

Brandon  15:28

yeah. Well, in a very random segue for you, Collin, I have some news that maybe you didn't know, because apparently, Susan just texted me. This is updated.

Collin Funkhouser  15:45

Didn't know.

Brandon  15:46

Updated three hours ago. Do you know who has won the Missouri class for state basketball championship?

Collin Funkhouser  15:58

No, I don't who. Who could it be? It was Logan Rogersville.

Brandon  16:08

Here we go. We are. LR, bang, that's bad. That sounds like newsworthy mention, right there.

Collin Funkhouser  16:17

Okay, I will send a link in there. Here's, here's the news that I read. Logan Roger all topped Clayton, 72 to 36 in a dominating performance. Class four boys basketball state champion. It's a little rough. 7236 a little harsh. Ouch. There was little question after a 42 point first half by the Wildcats,

Speaker 1  16:42

what oh, yeah, holy.

Collin Funkhouser  16:48

I mean, what cats, right?

Brandon  16:50

I just popped up on my thing here, so I throw that out there before.

Collin Funkhouser  16:55

Yeah, I know I never would have, would have guessed that. So who knew, who not me, do you get this? Okay? So I, I was telling somebody that I went to Missouri State and go Bears. Okay, go Bears. I said, Oh, I went to Missouri State. And the person then was like, Oh my gosh, man, that defensive line this year, huh?

Brandon  17:26

Yeah, yeah, that happens a lot, right? Like that. People assume that you're very invested in the university as an alum, right? Because I get that too, right? They're always like, Yo, but you're excited for the because they're like, the women's basketballs and, like, the thing right in the March Madness deal too. And they're like, oh, man, isn't that great? Like, I didn't know that, but okay, like, I I don't know. Like, I am not. Yeah, people think that you're like, super invested in everything that happens at the place where you went to college.

Speaker 1  18:07

And, no, like, I don't know.

Collin Funkhouser  18:15

And then, and then I'm always like, oh, what? And then they feel so let down because they they thought they had a chance to have, like a playmate for a little bit to talk about this thing that obviously they are so passionate about and know deeply and intimately, and are like, Ah, right? Like I can

Brandon  18:34

sense, I don't think they know it intimately, right? Well, feel like they just also heard about it right? Based on based on my hypothesis, based on some videos that I've been watching this week, and things I've been reading about is it's probably they are. It's more likely that they are. They have been caught up in the net of sports betting on everything, and so they have just been betting on them. And that's the only reason I know anything about anything. They either made money or lost money on set defensive life. That's the only reason they're following anything

Collin Funkhouser  19:17

that's unfor unfortunately, you're probably right, like, oh, I It feels so I don't know, like, I it's everywhere. I see it everywhere. Every ad I've got, I got, I got a mailer saying that they were, you could start doing it now, right? Yeah, I'm like, No, don't yeah.

Brandon  19:47

So yeah, basically, sports is ruined forever. Do you like, how, like, I don't know if, like, coincidentally, right, probably. Totally not related at all. But like, it feels like sports betting became Okay, the second Pete Rose died. Oh, right. Oh, as soon as Pete Rose died, they're like, Okay, all right, guys, go for it, because he's like, the last dude that was, like, blackballed forever for betting on baseball, right? Like, it's like, really scummy that baseball is, like, has this long history of, like, stick work against betting, right? The Chicago Black Sox Scandal is like the worst thing that's ever happened in baseball, right? We Kevin Costner had to make a whole movie about it with a cornfield, and like James Earl Jones was there to redeem their souls for the sin of sports betting. And then, like Pete Rose is like blacklisted from the Baseball Hall of Fame forever, and he can never receive any accolades from baseball because he bet, and betting is dirty. But Sign up now for DraftKings hashtag, not sponsored by the way, because you gross. So like the instant he died. Like, sports betting, like, explodes, like, because now we can talk about it without having to bring him up, because he's not there, right? It all the sports, like chat, like ESPN and Fox Sports can be just like, super grimy, right? And like, you can't watch any sports without them talking about, like the betting line, which is gross, and gambling addiction is a real problem that drives people into poverty and desperate situations. And this is how bad things happen. And but we're going to promote it, because somebody is going to make money on it, even though all the sports apps, like, if I was reading the thing I was reading about and watching, like, they say that, like, on those apps, if you win too much, they won't let you

Collin Funkhouser  22:02

bet anymore. Yes, yes. So, like, it's like, they actively like, punish, yeah. Like, it's not. People go into this thinking like, oh my gosh, I can make so much money. No, they they can't, you can't. And they don't tell you this. They're not like, Hey, we're going to limit your bets now. No, they just slowly start giving you less and less favorable odds. Like, it's not fair, and I don't I

Brandon  22:31

just it's also not fair that some players own a stake in the apps. Like, that's even worse. That's like, even grimier,

Collin Funkhouser  22:41

I know, like,

Brandon  22:43

it's like sports already kind of weren't real, but now they're definitely not real. It's like the most dystopian thing of all time, right?

Collin Funkhouser  22:55

So I just, I know, no,

Brandon  23:00

I also think it's really grimy, like those other apps that you let you bet on, like, random things, right? Like those, those ones are, like, even worse, because, because people were betting what day the US would bomb

Collin Funkhouser  23:14

Iran? Oh, I know.

Brandon  23:16

Surprise, surprise, a whole bunch of money was made on the day I wonder.

Collin Funkhouser  23:24

Well, people would say, Well, statistically, group markets and group think are better at picking averages and odds than just a single person, so

Brandon  23:32

they'll do it with also if those single people are in Congress or connected to government officials,

Collin Funkhouser  23:38

no, no. There is no evidence of people in Congress using their position money or advanced trades with businesses based on regulation. That's look, I'm all here for lizard people and movies, but you sir, have crossed the line over our institutions. I the house. But

Collin Funkhouser  24:06

seriously, let's talk about those Moon bases, right? They go, No, I

Brandon  24:10

also, yeah, I just, I just was, I just was thinking about this. Like, Man, I think, I think it is, I think it was the death of Pete Rose that, like, made it okay, like, socially, because now there is no person to look at and be like, Hey, wait. But he did that, and you don't like him, right? So he's not there anymore. So they're like, Oh, if this person does it, that's cool in 2025 because Pete Rose dead. So like, whatever. And then 2026 like, always keep going, yeah. Like, sure. LeBron James can advertise for it, and people can get in trouble, because if you bet on the point spread, and you're a player in the game betting on the point spread, wait, i. Have Hold on.

Collin Funkhouser  25:07

Oh, I know it's just crazy,

Brandon  25:12

so I'm sorry, Pete, did you dirty buddy? Just

Collin Funkhouser  25:16

waited like, Ah,

Brandon  25:19

I think, I think it's just a bit coincidental that, like that's fair. He died in 2024 and then in 2025 all these sports betting markets expanded dramatically, and they're advertised into oblivion during live sporting events. I Yeah, so much so that there was one thing they I kept seeing us on a video. It was hilarious that ESPN was reporting on, like a points fixing thing, like scandal that was in, like NBA or whatever. And like, in the middle of reporting it. They had to take down their little sports betting banner in the corner of the ad on the screen because somebody realized, oh, wait, like mid sentence, it just like, goes away, like, like, because they're reporting on how bad betting is while being sponsored by sports fitting out. Yeah, guys suck. You guys are so bad.

Collin Funkhouser  26:36

Oh, I don't know. I'll never, I'll never be okay with it. I don't know. I'm just not a betting kind of person, and I think it

Brandon  26:46

predatory and gross. It is,

Collin Funkhouser  26:49

it is, and I and the fact that people I don't know, like, it's not a, Oh, I understand it. You don't. That's why I don't do it. It's just like a, it's not like, worth it. I don't, whatever. Okay, this is,

Brandon  27:01

no, I agree totally. Like this is yes, I don't already ate too much money in sports. We don't need more.

Collin Funkhouser  27:09

Whoa, whoa, sir. I Oh my gosh, it's so bad. I Oh yeah,

Speaker 1  27:25

that was just a random side note that I was thinking about this week too, like, Dang dang

Brandon  27:36

sorry, man. I didn't really do anything else this week. That's why we had this school chugging on, yeah, in this our spring break is next weekend, so next weekend, yeah, it's like a we're going weird. Like, no, not next week. It's so we had, we don't have the kids don't come to school Monday, because it's like a PD day thing. And then we so we have four days next week, and then the week after that, we're, for some reason, going

Speaker 1  28:11

Monday and Tuesday, and then are going to be off Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, just randomly, that's our spring break again.

Speaker 1  28:28

Yeah, that's what's happening. But Yeah, cuz Yeah, yesterday was parent teacher conferences.

Collin Funkhouser  28:38

Yeah, yeah, it was your favorite part?

Brandon  28:42

Well, no, it's not, because, again, they did it like they did last time. I don't know who wants this. I don't know who's asking for it. I don't know who's clamoring for this to happen, but we had a half day, right? And then we did parent teacher conferences from two to six, right? And in that time, like, nobody came, because it's spring conferences. So like, if, if I haven't called you already, like, yeah, there was, you know, like, so some people came, but it was like 12 people, something like that, right? We have like 55 people, so just sitting around, no for a long time.

Collin Funkhouser  29:37

So much free time. It was nice. I'm sure you got, you take a nap, pull some work ahead for the next weeks, and really weird. Dial in for that. It was so weird.

Brandon  29:51

So it's like, I don't know, whatever, it's fine, but like.

Speaker 1  30:00

Like, you know, I just, I don't understand. I understand why we do this. I don't know who thought this was a brilliant plan. Like, Ah, yes, this is the answer everyone was looking for.

Collin Funkhouser  30:13

Obviously, no, no. It wasn't, no, twas wasn't.

Speaker 1  30:18

It was not,

Brandon  30:21

I didn't, like, we used to do it, like, a long time ago, we did a Monday and Tuesday, like, four to seven, but then we didn't have school Friday, yeah.

Speaker 1  30:34

Like, this is fine. It was fine. Like, I know they're, like, worried about people not being able to make it. Able to make it. Give them two days. Wow, look at that amazing, right?

Brandon  30:51

So whatever, I don't know, but slogged through that. It was rough,

Speaker 1  30:58

so really uneventful that's pretty much nothing I was doing is working towards parent teacher conferences. And then we did go to another volleyball game this week. It was not, didn't go quite so good. The team was really good.

Collin Funkhouser  31:21

Was good,

Brandon  31:25

yeah, so it's right, it's fine. It's fine. Because, like, I mean, you can't wait, like, we lost, but like, it was, it was, you know, the other team was, like, very good. So, like, Yeah, can't really be mad, right? Like, yeah, yeah.

Collin Funkhouser  31:40

Like, okay, got game. Gotcha understood, yeah, yeah. Like, okay, if I'm gonna lose to somebody, I want to be the best, like, a really stinking good team. Yeah, some of

Brandon  31:49

the kids were like, were you clapping for the other team? Was like, Did you see that serve? Okay? I mean, they were so good look. Important part about being spectator, you got to recognize. Yeah, good game. All right, hey, like, you can't, you can't be mad at that serve. Okay, I know it wasn't good for our team personally, but oh my gosh, it was so good. So like, give a little, a little, you know, good job. Good job. So, like,

Collin Funkhouser  32:19

you know this is what you need. Well, did you? Did you hear anything in sixth grade this week?

Brandon  32:27

I did, all right, I have one of those for you before we start our insanity. I six weeks chapter

Collin Funkhouser  32:37

screened. Yeah,

Brandon  32:40

so like, but here you go. So this, this occurred before school, right? Like before class started. Okay, it's in the morning when everyone's getting there, all right. So sitting there and this girl just goes, I should, but I keep being distracted by my muffin. Yes, I think she was put her stuff away, take her bag to the little closet thing that softball people are keeping their stuff in, right? Yeah. And she was just like, yeah, I should, but I keep being distracted by my muffin. Oh, no,

Collin Funkhouser  33:27

you know what it happens.

Brandon  33:29

You know it does, it does? It looks like a good muffin too. So, like, Yeah, it's fine. It's worth but, like, it was really funny. This one I got, I got one for here they go.

Collin Funkhouser  33:46

Yeah, that'll do. That will do.

Brandon  33:56

But, oh, okay, my

Collin Funkhouser  33:59

day, all right. So Wow. So last we left

Brandon  34:02

hipparino hip

Collin Funkhouser  34:06

he had, he just,

Brandon  34:10

yeah, right. So he got a letter from Miss Havisham to go and see her about the thing, right? They were discussing, they discussed money for our boy, HERBIE, right? Yes. And she was like, Hey, come talk to me. I want to talk to you about this thing, right? And so he's like, Well, yeah, I'll go tomorrow, right? And so, bang, that's what happened. He took the note with him, just in case. Because, you know, you never know what this place like, just in case someone's like, why are you here? He's gonna be like, Look see. She told me to come.

Collin Funkhouser  34:53

Well, yeah. And I thought that was brilliant. This was a brilliant move of his. Of you know, he's learned. A little bit here. I don't know where this brilliance has come from. I don't really

Brandon  35:04

know. Yeah, it's tough,

Collin Funkhouser  35:07

yeah, oh, man. And he, he heads there. He's also like, I'm gonna walk again. For some reason I don't really know. Well, he

Brandon  35:17

doesn't walk the whole way. Yeah, he, like, basically takes the carriage till like, one stop before,

Collin Funkhouser  35:24

I guess technically, the halfway house.

Brandon  35:26

Oh yeah. But, like, it just see, I don't know how many stops there are, but like, he takes it, like, most of the way, and then he wants to walk because he wants to be, like, inconspicuous. He doesn't want people to see him getting off at the carriage stop. Because I think the carriage stops like, in the middle of town, in front of the inn, or whatever, and it's like,

Collin Funkhouser  35:43

oh, where he met Dremel, yeah, or whatever, yeah, yeah.

Brandon  35:47

So I think he just wants to slip in, slip out, right? He doesn't want to be a thing. He doesn't want to see anybody. He's just like, man, whatever. So he does this. He goes inside. We have a very we get a lot of like, I don't think this is technically a word, but sepulcher imagery here right about everything. We're talking about the church, and then we're comparing it to like the house. I'm talking about graves and funeral music, riots, like a whole thing. So again, foreshadowing question mark, like,

Collin Funkhouser  36:32

yeah, everything's dead, dying and awful, and he's feeling it's very foreboding to him as he's coming in. And I also think it's interesting that I don't know the significance of this, but I have noticed that since Estella has left, the people who meet him at the gate of Miss havisham's have all been different,

Brandon  37:01

yes, right? He says, like, I didn't even know

Collin Funkhouser  37:04

this lady, this person was, he thought another person was Orlick one time, yeah, like, I don't. It's very like, in a in a place that had no change and nothing changed it, there was things happening on the outside right? Like, it's very, very interesting. Like just going, you can't hold stasis forever and and true to form, we also see more changes coming up.

Brandon  37:34

Yeah, it just feels like heavier inside, too, right? Like, it's even more oppressive somehow,

Collin Funkhouser  37:46

like, and he even that's not great. He even recognizes he's has this phrase of, as he's walking, he's talking about the loneliness and seeing her, he says, and thinking, how, in the progress of time, I too had come to be part of the wrecked fortunes of that house. Her eyes rested on me, basically, all this decay and wrecked, you know, excitement and expectations for the future, he has now also become part of the wrecked nature of that and is not it's not working out. And he sees himself as part of the the misfortune, I guess, you know, also inflicted purposefully, as we will, yeah,

Brandon  38:29

and, but he's like, kind of dealing with it, yeah? Because, as we'll see in a minute, like, he's just kind of like, whatever, it's fine. You know, I got other things worry about. I can't be worried about this mess now, because I got to worry about being hunted by the law and not having any money. And weird pro this guy got locked in an attic somewhere.

Collin Funkhouser  38:53

Can't have bigger fish

Brandon  38:54

at this so he's going to haberson because he wants to secure this money for Herbert, right?

Collin Funkhouser  39:03

And she's like, she's earnest about this. She wants to prove she says, and to show you that I am not all stone. But perhaps you could never believe that there is anything human in my heart, and like she's really concerned that she not be known for, yeah, this

Brandon  39:24

right, because, you know, because he says, Well, this, you know, make you happy. Will it put you at rest? He's like, Well, it will put me at rest. And she goes, Are you happy? He says, I am far from happy, Miss Havisham, but I have other causes of disquiet than any you know, of they are the secrets that I have mentioned, right? The secrets of another. It's like, I can't tell you about them, even though I kind of want to, but they're not my secrets, so I can't tell you all right? And so he was like, Is it is it true? You know? So, yeah, right. Is. True, because she says, so I can only help you by helping your friend. And he's like, yeah, yeah. He's like, don't you want anything? He's like, no, no, I'm good. He's like, No, I don't I'm tired of just getting that, so just help him. Like, I don't care. And then, you know? So she's, like, she's basically, you know, what comes out of this is that she is just sort of realizing all of the damage that she has been doing to people, right? And somehow, finally took Estella leading for her to, like, come face to face with it, right? And like, now it's upsetting her, you know? So, you know, she's basically like, she says, she starts, says for the first time, right? You know my name is on the first thief, if you can ever write under my name, I forgive her, though ever so long after my broken heart is dust. I pray you do and PIP is basically like, Yo listen, I'll do it right now. There have been sore mistakes, and my life has been a blind and thankless one, and I want forgiveness and direction far too much to be bitter with you. Like, I have my own things to deal with. Like, a lot of some of this is my fault, and so I take ownership of a lot of these, and I'm not gonna blame you for it at all, so they'll stop like,

Collin Funkhouser  41:43

yes, you know, because he had this, he talks about this, I want forgiveness and direction far too much like he himself is looking for forgiveness from others for the situation that he's put them in through his own actions and and he still is needing direction, but he's got a lot more of it now than he ever had before, because he's got, Like, a purpose. And I think that that's part of this, this drive that he has, of this is this is a purpose that He has to correct some wrongs, write some rights, and to bring peace, at least to a few people, and good people. And he sees, hey, I can do these things, use these connections, and that's really pushing him forward through this,

Brandon  42:25

yeah, right. He's like, he's just really focused on, like, Herbert right now and trying to deal with that, right? That little moment of clarity he had the couple of chapters to go whenever he met Clara, right? Yeah, it's like, dang it, I'm sorry I messed everything up for you, because she's nice, and you deserve to be happy with the nice person, and I'm sorry. So, like, he's trying to get this done, and so he's trying to do with that. And Miss Havisham is very morose, basically, about the loss of Estella, because, you know, she's not coming back here anymore, really, like, that's not gonna be a thing that happens. And she starts wailing, what have I done? Over and over again, right, right? And he says, if you have, if you mean Miss, average, and what have you done to injure me? Let me answer very little. I should have loved her under any circumstance. Yeah, right.

Collin Funkhouser  43:30

So I and then like, and she keeps asking him, what have I What? What have I done? What have I done? And he, he reaches a point where he's like, I didn't know how to answer her. Like, if you mean molding an impressionable child and spurning to affection and wounding. Like, yeah, I know that she did that, but I love this, he says, but that in shutting out the light of day, she had shut out infinitely more, that in seclusion, she had secluded herself from 1000 natural and healing influences that her mind, brooding solitary had grown diseased as all minds do and must and will that reverse the appointed order of their maker. I knew equally well. Ah, like I what the part where he said, um, she had secluded herself from 1000 natural and healing influences that if she had actually embraced more life, it would have done more healing to her than what she was trying to do, and by setting herself in stone, that, yeah, you couldn't, you could not stop The healing influences of being around others and seeing good in other people, like he sees themselves in that and like Herbert, like, that's his one example of like, yeah, if you just like, even if you are doing cruddy things, which he PIP would say, I myself am doing horrible cruddy things, and I'm wasting this I encountered Herbert in a. Amazing, good and wonderful thing in my life, and it's made me a little bit better. If she had just done that, where would she have been now,

Brandon  45:07

yeah, women, we can count women also, right?

Collin Funkhouser  45:10

Oh yeah. Like, it's just, and then i

Brandon  45:18

Yes, right, yeah, because she talks about somewhere in here, she's like, I didn't mean to, oh, like, what she's talking about, Estella. She's like, I didn't mean to, at first, right? Like, I tried to love her, like for realsies,

Speaker 1  45:31

but then, right?

Brandon  45:36

I, you know, I couldn't do it.

Collin Funkhouser  45:39

I meant, she said, I meant to save her from misery like my own. And she she thought, and I love that she thought that by making Estella something, she would protect Estella. But what she saw during the interaction, and why she was so horrified is because she realized that she had just hurt Pip, like she Yeah, and that she didn't, the one thing she was trying to prevent actually manifest in somebody who I haven't, I guess, to some extent, does kind of care about, ah, you know, in PIP to some extent,

Speaker 1  46:17

yeah, yeah, because he's only a bit Nice to her, you know. And she's never, you know, whatever, right?

Brandon  46:27

And she says again, while you know, she kind of starts talking like, if you if you only knew some compassion for me. And he's like, hey, yeah, I do like I have known ever since I first left this neighborhood, it has inspired me with great commiseration, and I hope understanding its influences right, like I need you to know that I do know Most of it right. So, like, calm down. He's trying not to tell her, like, how he knows, but like, I know. And then he does get to the other reason that he is here, right? He's like, so I have a question. I know that you took in Stella

Speaker 1  47:23

from WHO?

Collin Funkhouser  47:25

Yeah. He said, How, right, how'd you,

Brandon  47:26

yeah, yeah, you know. And, you know, he's like, whose child is she? And she's, she's like, I don't know. Jaggers just brought her here, uh huh, and he's like, and, and how old would you say she was? She's like, Oh, I don't know, two or three. Maybe he's like,

Brandon  48:02

so she tells him that basically, so that's, you know,

Collin Funkhouser  48:05

and then he's like, Well, I don't need to prolong this anymore, so I'll go wander about the garden someone.

Brandon  48:13

Well, he's gonna leave first. He doesn't. He didn't mean to do that first, right? Well, yeah, he gets he he's leaving, right? He was gonna leave. And then he's just, like, he just kind of was overcome with this feeling that he was never gonna be back here again, yeah, and so he just was gonna take a turn around the place, yeah, to kind of like, soak it in for one

Collin Funkhouser  48:42

last bit, right? It's interesting how he does that with Miss havisham's, but he didn't do that with his own home. Yeah, right. That's true. Like, I don't know, I don't know where that comes from, but I think it also it puts pip in a different circumstance, because from the very beginning, Pip had every intention of always returning home. He was always gonna get back. He was always he was always going to come back home and see everybody and party, promising people,

Brandon  49:14

yeah, so he may yet, right, that's what we that's what I was kind of taking from this. I was like, that he might still do that. Because I think he's washing his hands of this, yes, and he's saying, like, this is not because, like, you know, at first he was, like, excited to come here and be doing stuff and see the stuff, and then now he's just like, yeah, no, this No. And so I think he's just sort of taking a turn around, because he's remembering he walks by like where he met first met Herbert, right as the pale young gentleman, he walks by where he saw Estella walk on the casks. Allegedly, he walks around the garden where he walked with Estella that time, and he starts to leave, right? He's noticed. Thing that, like, it's even more rundown than it already was. You know, there's basically, it's like, it's so decayed and so decrepit. There's no coming back. So he's getting ready to leave,

Collin Funkhouser  50:17

but, right? He's like, like, but maybe I wonder, I hope she I hope Habersham is okay or safe. I think, yeah, he

Brandon  50:28

like, he's like, he's thinking about that. He's thinking about, like, whatever. But he looks up and he has this, like, weird vision of her, of Miss Havisham, like, dangling from a beam.

Collin Funkhouser  50:42

Did he see this once before?

Brandon  50:46

Something like that, right? He saw her like at the window, where there was like, this weird, ominous, like feeling that came over him, right? And so he's like, So strong was the impression that I stood under the beam, shuddering from head to foot. I knew it was a fancy though, to be sure it was there in an instant, right the mournfulness of the place in time, in the great terror of this illusion, though it but momentary, caused me to feel an indescribable awe as I came out between the open wooden gate where I had once wrung my hair after Estella had rubbed my heart passing into the front courtyard. I hesitated whether to call the woman to let me out or to run back upstairs and see

Collin Funkhouser  51:31

if there's temperatures. Is she okay? Yes, yeah.

Brandon  51:33

He was like, I'm just gonna go check. Like, I'm getting some real bad spooky vibes right now. I'm gonna go check. This is like the most like, what even does this plot device, but whatever, like, you know, it's fine.

Collin Funkhouser  51:47

So, oh, oh my gosh. I was reading this quickly, and I made it like four sentences down from this moment, and I had to pause and go back and start this again, because I was like, I'm sorry.

Brandon  52:04

What? Yeah, yeah, this paragraph is like, what in the heck, right? I looked into the room where I had left her, and I saw her seated in the ragged chair upon the hearth, close to the fire, with her back toward me in the moment when I was withdrawing my head to go quietly away, I saw a great flaming light spring up in the same moment I saw her running at me, shrieking with a whirl of fire blazing all about her and soaring at least as Many feet above her head as she was high. What right now she we, here's what I'm thinking right earlier, when he came in the room, he like specifically mentions the fire was very low,

Collin Funkhouser  52:56

well, and yeah. And at some point she was having trouble focusing on him, so she said, Let me focus on something. And she turns and she's like, she's intently focusing on the fire while he's telling her about what he wants to help, have her help her bird, yeah, she's like,

Brandon  53:12

Sony, distraught and distracted that like she can't assume, because Estella is not here, right? Blah, blah, blah, whatever. Everyone's mad because estella's gone. But yeah, so I we specifically mentioned the low fire at some point, right? We specifically mentioned her, like, gazing into the fire. So I don't know if she was, like, poking it right, like, I don't know what's happening here. I don't know if it was the fire was so low she, like, is closer to it to try to get some sort of warmth. I don't know what's happening, or was

Collin Funkhouser  53:44

that an intentional thing? I don't know. I don't know. I doubt

Brandon  53:50

who knows. But like her crusty old wedding dress, apparently, apparently real flammable, highly flammable, right? Yeah, and it just like engulfs her in this fire. So PIP takes off his great coat, and he just like, tackles her, like, it starts like, smothering her with the coat, right? But he's like, I can't really, like, I don't really, he's like, I don't really know what's going on all I can just smell Bernie, right? And all of the fire has, like, disturbed all of the Beatles and spiders and they're running across the floor. That's, didn't?

Collin Funkhouser  54:44

He pull something down? Didn't? Maybe that was something else he tried to fear that result, as Curtis knew his all. But anyway, yeah, he doesn't really know. Oh, we were buying this

Brandon  54:55

is No, when he goes, they take her to the

Collin Funkhouser  54:56

table. Oh, that's whenever they do that.

Brandon  54:59

Yeah. Sorry. Like, or is that here? He Yeah, he like, rips off the tablecloth and all of

Collin Funkhouser  55:10

the I dragged the great cloth from the table for the same purpose, and with it, dragged down the heap of rottenness in the midst and all the ugly things that sheltered there, that we were on the ground struggling like desperate enemies, and then the closer I covered her, the more wildly she shrieked to try to free herself, yeah. So he was

Brandon  55:24

trying to smother the flames, and he threw the coat on her, yeah? And he grabs the table cloth, because it's just there, and he just yanks it. And all the wedding cake, all the place settings, all this, everything, just like rips apart, right? And it's like, I don't know, this is definitely some symbology, right? Like it was, like we're tearing down at least one thing here, right? Like it's gone and it's just all burned up and destroyed and you know, they're every they could get a call for assistance, right? And he just I held her until it came, as if I unreasonably fancied that if I let her go, the fire would break out again and consume her when I got up, the surgeon coming to her with other aid. I was astonished to see that both my hands were burnt for I had no knowledge of it through the sense of feeling right. So he was so focused on her that he didn't even realize that his hands are like burned up. Yeah, yeah, pretty bad, right? So she is pretty seriously injured, but they are of themselves. Were far from hopeless, right? The danger lay mainly in the nervous shock, the most dangerous of things in the mid 1800s Right? Like, Oh no,

Collin Funkhouser  56:59

I think, I think a certain Star Wars director would want to have a word with you, sir, that's true. You know

Brandon  57:09

how you turn to the dark side, apparently, right? Apparently. This is also how, this is how people bad things would happen in the in like the 1850s right? They're like, Oh no, you're a hysterical woman who is traumatically injured. Yes, you need some laudanum, right? Like, straight up morphine, like, oh, oh no.

Collin Funkhouser  57:34

But they take her and they're like, they instruct her to be laid on her table.

Brandon  57:41

Yeah, they put her because it's like, right there, so that they can address her and address her wounds. They just layer down on the table. And PIP does notice like, Huh? I found like, dang, yeah. Like hmm, the weird, like,

Collin Funkhouser  58:05

an hour afterwards, she lay, indeed, where I had seen her strike her stick and had heard her say that she would lie one day. Yeah, yeah, don't say yeah.

Brandon  58:15

So here she is. They've like, wrapped her. He's like, she still looks right. He says she still has something of her old ghastly bridal appearance, for they had covered her to the throat with white cotton wool as she lay with a white sheet loosely over that, the Phantom air of something that had been and was changed was upon her. We also find out that Estella is in pain. In Paris, so

Collin Funkhouser  58:44

yes, good to know. Oh, and he does, he does. He does. He's like, God, I'll tell Miss Havisham family by only telling Mr. Pocket, and he'll take care of the rest well, because he's

Brandon  59:01

the only one that like PIP likes, I know, right?

Collin Funkhouser  59:05

It was just funny. He's like, and I took it upon myself to tell her family. So I only told Mr. Pocket. I know why he does it. It's just funny how in one sentence, he's like, I'll tell her all. I'll tell her entire family. So anyway, Mr. Pocket knows, yeah, I'm gonna tell Mr.

Brandon  59:21

Matthew Pocket, the one person that actually I like and is kind and like relatively normal, and who actually kind of likes Miss Iverson, sort of a little bit. But he also does this through her I'm gonna tell Herbert. I'll tell HERBIE, okay, we'll do that, and then he can relay the message for me, right? And she's just sort of like pretty out of it, right? She keeps repeating the same phrase over and over again, yeah? And she skips words every once in a while, which is a weird little detail to put in here, but yeah. Yeah, right. So, you know, that's it he been, he, like, gives a little kiss when she's saying, like, I I forgive her. I think he like, says it with her, right? Like, I forgive her. That's his whole thing there and then, and then they he leaves, right? So, yeah, that was an event that occurred. Holy cannoli. Like, yes, why I was not expecting, like, I again, this whole entire book, like, I have no idea, like, what the point like, again, I don't know, like, where this is ostensibly the story about PIP, but it's basically just like, Pip uncovers information about people in the past. Like, that's what this whole book is and but I was definitely not expecting flaming miss. Oh no, Human Torch. Habersham here, right? Yeah, I was very shocking turn of events,

Collin Funkhouser  1:01:07

okay, I know I just okay. That's what we're doing. That's what we're doing here. Yeah, and 19, sorry, the next chapter. Sorry, my book said, had 19 pages in this, because I'm reading it on an e reader. So the first, right? Anyway, so I just said chapter 19.

Speaker 1  1:01:28

No, 50 is the next one? Yes, 50.

Collin Funkhouser  1:01:32

I don't know this was, this is a he basically, this is this the vignette of PIP is has his bandages dressed and comforted by Herbert,

Brandon  1:01:43

yeah, but Herbert is back, though, right? And we get the again, but again, we get information here, right, distilled to us from Herbert within the classic Herbert style, where he's like now, let me tell you this thing. Hold on. Would you mind moving your arm a bit? Oh my gosh. I Oh, it's just like, all Herbert dialog is like this. He's like, but then when I told her, hold on, move your wrist a little, okay, now, but like, so he's redressing the bandages, right? Yeah, he's doing about this. And he's like, Oh, I had a little chatterino with Provis when I was over at Clarence. He was like, I talked to him for like, two hours, boy. And he was like, two hours. What was your girl doing for two hours? She was like, oh, attending to her father's banging about on the floor, pepper and rum

Collin Funkhouser  1:02:39

and rum and pepper and sure, I'm sure he'll be about done. And then he's like, when he talks about how the I think when Herbert is saying, like, I don't think he'll be able to do that for much more basically, like, we're kind of approaching the end, I feel like, that's the way I

Brandon  1:02:54

read it, yeah. Pips,

Collin Funkhouser  1:02:57

like, and then you'll marry her.

Brandon  1:03:00

He's like, Oh yes, of course, absolutely, absolutely,

Collin Funkhouser  1:03:06

oh, right, yeah. I love how there's also, they're also not communicating a lot of stuff. Because in the beginning here, they're like, neither of us spoke of the boat, but we both thought of it that was made apparent by our avoidance of the subject,

Brandon  1:03:21

yeah, because they're like, well, because, yeah, they're like, Well, I can't row with burned up hands, so I really need to concentrate on, like, making sure that I address these and, like, try to get healed so that I can get back to boat rowing for The Great Escape. Obviously, right? Yes. So that's kind of what they're that's why, uh, Herbert is so, like, insistent on, like, helping him wrap things right, yeah. But anyway, right, then all of a sudden, we just get this paragraph right? Just like, bang, um, yeah, where

Collin Funkhouser  1:03:53

Herbert's like, Hey, you mentioned that Provis has kind of changed. I think he's kind of changed too. And he opened up a lot about his past life, and yeah, and

Brandon  1:04:03

again, between talks about the bandage and it doesn't hurt, does it? No, it's fine. Tell me more about the story. Like, basically, right, he was, he had a girl who was a woman, was a young woman and a jealous woman and a revengeful woman, revengeful handle to the last degree. To what last degree murder, murder? Does it strike too cold on the sensitive place. Like, is Herbert back on task buddy. Like, what

Speaker 1  1:04:39

I was like, I don't feel it. How did she murder? Whom did she murder?

Brandon  1:04:46

She was tried for it, and Mr. Jaggers defended her, and the reputation of that defense first made his name known to Provis It was another and stronger woman who was the victim, and there had. Been a struggle in a barn. Who began it, or how fair it was, or how unfair may be doubtful, but how it ended is certainly not doubtful. For the victim was found throttled. Right? Was the woman brought in guilty? Why No? Dearest handle she was acquitted Bye.

Collin Funkhouser  1:05:22

Is this sounding familiar? And

Brandon  1:05:27

so all the way, like, basically, Herbert keeps interrupting, saying, Now move your hand. Does that hurt? Pips like, shut up.

Collin Funkhouser  1:05:34

Keep telling me this stuff. I want to know the story. Keep talking. Yes, it's fantastic.

Speaker 1  1:05:41

Oh, right. So, you know,

Collin Funkhouser  1:05:46

but, but, hey, here's the here's the thing. Before, it was unclear, because I think was it wimick That was telling us this, like, wimic was basically like, I don't, we don't know if she did this or not. I can't say, we don't say this is now 100% saying she murdered this person in the barn. Like, yes, like this, well, when we make was

Brandon  1:06:08

also saying we don't know what happened to the child. Oh, right. Whitmock was like, also saying, like, because they're like, did she destroy the child's like, I don't know, right? Yeah, we don't know if she did or not, right, but that was the evidence they used to get her off. Was like, no, she couldn't have killed the lady, because she was busy killing this baby, obviously, right? Yes, which is not what happened, right? And there's like, so what happened to the child? Right? And so therefore, fearing he should be called upon to depose about this destroyed child and to be the cause of her death, he hid himself, kept himself dark, as he says, out of the way and out of the trial and was only vaguely talked of as a certain man called Abel, out of whom the jealousy arose. After the acquittal, she disappeared, and thus he lost the child. And the child's mother,

Speaker 1  1:07:12

yes, yes, right, yeah.

Collin Funkhouser  1:07:17

And because we were also told a couple things that Provis really doted on this child, like, yes, deeply, deeply loved his daughter, and yes, um, and so this was incredibly hard for him to watch and witness. And it was, must have been a very confusing an upset of time having been sidelined through this. Yes.

Brandon  1:07:46

And so the final question PIP has is, when do you think this would happen? Oh, yes. And Herbert's like, well, let me see again, how older were you whenever you first met him in the churchyard, and he's like, oh, about seven. He's like, Yeah, it was probably about three or four years before that interesting.

Collin Funkhouser  1:08:13

Miss Habersham had said

Brandon  1:08:16

two, three, right? Because he I like, he's like, he's like, Listen, you are. And he's like, Listen, this part's bizarre. He was like, All right, look, I need you to feel my head. And he's like, What you talking about? He's like, feel it. He's like, I'm not feverish, right? You would say that I am not feverish and that my head is much disordered by the accident of last night. He's like, No, you're, I mean, you're, you're fine, you're talking, you're forming good sentences. You seem to be coherent. So he's like, but you do seem rather excited. He's like, I am rather excited.

Speaker 1  1:08:54

I know I am quite myself. And the man we have hidden down the river is a stillness. Father, is

Brandon  1:09:07

boy howdy stuff is ridiculous. And then, yeah, so then Chad 51 we go, he's like, I gotta talk to jackers about this, right? I must confront him. I and like, Okay, why? I'm not real sure. But he's like, What purpose I had in view when I was in hot on the tracking out and proving a seller's parentage. I cannot say it will be. He's like, I don't know if it was because I just wanted to do it for her sake, or if I wanted to transfer some of this concern, right, some of my love for Estella on to Provis Right? Like to give me like, if I can prove this is true, then maybe. I can accept him and like, Be okay with hanging out with him, right? Like, that's, I think that's, that's actually what's happening. Let's be

Collin Funkhouser  1:10:08

because he was so horrified initially remember, and he's, like, really thrown off by Provis and everything that he stands for, yeah,

Brandon  1:10:18

and, but it turns out he's everything he thought he stood for was not correct, right? Like he was making assumptions again, right? Pip loves to make assumptions and jump to conclusions, like his favorite thing in the world, but when he digs deeper and finds like, Well, why did he feel this way? Why did he get put in the situation? Well, because he had a girlfriend and a daughter, and he thought he lost them both, and he was like, super bummed out, and, like, it was a whole thing, and he was like, super depressed. And then he went over here. So like, Pip is like, uncovering this information is making PIP sympathize with him. Well, right? And like,

Collin Funkhouser  1:11:01

is this where we are also told that Provis, I can't remember if it was this chapter. Is it the next? Did we skip over this where basically comp and Jason became compeyson? Compeyson? Is that, where is it in this chapter?

Brandon  1:11:22

Or he does say like no, he says, the evil genius compeyson The worst of scoundrels among many scoundrels, yelling of his keeping out of the way at that time, and of his reasons for doing so, of course, afterwards, held the knowledge over his head as a means of keeping him poorer and working him harder. It was clear last night that this barbed point was the point of provis's animosity. So the reason he was so like violent towards compass on when he saw him on the marshes was because he was like, holding this over him, and like using it to instigate him, and, like all this stuff. Was like, Oh, I know that this is the truth. So you can't, you have to work for me, or I'll let the authorities know that you're they killed your daughter. Like, so, yes, I think that also softened PIP a little bit too the whole situation to be like, oh yeah. Oh so he, he was like, not, he's not a villain of his own free will, right? Like, he was forced to do a lot of these things by this guy. And, like, I mean, that should also be apparent by like, once he left, once he was in Australia, he was just, like, ranching, yes, he wasn't doing crimes. He wasn't like crime bossing. He wasn't like doing, like villainous deeds. He was ranching sheep, right? Like, potentially, as, like a his own, like penance, you know, he ran away. He was in Australia. He was like, just working hard, like, doing everything, like, nothing bad, nothing nefarious, no crimeing, just sheep hurting, right? So I think PIP is being like, Ah, okay, okay, okay, well, okay, I see that

Collin Funkhouser  1:13:24

makes sense. Yep, yeah. So

Brandon  1:13:28

anyway, we go to Jaggers, because he wants to know the secret. Like, he's like, he just wants confirmation that he is right for some reason, again, he doesn't know why. It's not going to help anything, but he wants to know, and so he goes, he goes over here, and Jaggers is being all jaggery, right, which is hilarious. And like, he also accidentally at some point, like, I don't know if he, like, makes wimmik a little mad at him, but like, we'll see how that goes. But he is asking these questions, right? And he's like, Hey, so why do you know this? And I have, I know, I just know who she is. I've seen the mother, and I know who the father is, and I am pretty sure it's this guy. He's like, Well, who is he? And he's like, a man by the name of Provis from New South Wales. And Jagger's like, actually jolts. And it's like, and the guard is down, and PIP

Collin Funkhouser  1:14:35

is like, Oh, I got it. I got it. And he's like, he it was almost imperceptible, and it was, it was done by the man, a man who was like had practice and withheld and suppressed this kind of thing over and over and over again, and yet, I got it. I got

Brandon  1:14:51

the ring like Does, does Provis make the claim he does not, and has never made it, and has no knowledge or belief that his daughter. Is in existence, right? For once, the powerful pocket handkerchief failed. Yes. My reply was so unexpected that Miss Jaggers put the handkerchief back into his pocket without completing the usual performance, folded his arms and looked with stern attention at me through an immovable face. Right? And then, yeah, he's, this is where he's like, listen, I just want to know. I just want to, I just got to tell you what I think. And, oh, you know, well,

Collin Funkhouser  1:15:34

and women or sorry, he goes on, and he tells the full story to Jaggers, except that he makes it believe, makes Jaggers believe that the piece of information actually came from Habersham instead of wemmick, so that he

Brandon  1:15:51

doesn't want him to sell out of this, right?

Collin Funkhouser  1:15:53

And I love, like he finishes, and Jaggers is, like, ah, wimick, what were you working on before he came in? Like, tries to do this, like, redirection for some weird reason. And he's like, but I could not submit to being thrown off in that way. And I made a passionate, almost an indignant appeal to him. And then he, like, they does, like, a big summarizing. I love this of like, obviously there's a lot said here that they're not going to go back and forth on. I and i Yeah, anyway, I this is such an interesting interaction, because then he ends by pointing to Weck and basically saying, and why don't Can you talk to Jaggers here, since I know you and everything. And Jaggers is like, what?

Brandon  1:16:46

Well, yeah, when he's like, he's like, listen, I know the type of man you are with your you know, taking care of your parent and your beautiful house. And Jaggers goes, you liar, yeah,

Collin Funkhouser  1:16:58

what's all this? You as an old father and you with pleasant and playful ways.

Brandon  1:17:05

Yeah, he's like, What's it matter for you? He's like, I don't bring him here. What does it matter? He's like, I'm all business here. Shut up. And so, like, this is where I was, like, women gonna be pissed off about this, like, because he's kind of blown his cover a little bit, because him and Jaggers just, like, look at each other now, like, Hmm, what are you doing, right? Yeah, yeah. So he he also does this thing where Jaggers does the thing. He finally kind of gives in, and is like, all right. And he's like, so but again, he's doing the whole like, I I need you, like, I'm not making any admissions hypothetically, saying, like, hypothetically, he doesn't say hypothetically. He's using another term. I'll put a case. He's like, Yeah. He's like, put this case right. Put the

Collin Funkhouser  1:17:52

case right. I admit nothing.

Brandon  1:17:56

Like, I'll put the case to you. Like, this, mind, this is all basically. He's like, hypothetically, allegedly, right? He's like, hypothetically, what if, right, a woman under circumstances, as you had mentioned, we're obliged to communicate the fact to her legal advisor that, you know, we should, you know, hide the child away. So hypothetically, if that happened and somebody maybe did this

Collin Funkhouser  1:18:27

love that he says, Put the case that at the same time, he held a trust to find a child for an eccentric rich lady.

Brandon  1:18:33

Yeah, so what if one lady was like, Yo, I need you to take care of my child. And then, allegedly, this guy had already agreed to help some other lady find a child. Might he give the child from the First Lady to the second? Hypothetically speaking, right? And he's like, you follow. Course I follow. He's like, going on. He keeps going with it. He's like, so I, I, you know, this is something that a person would do and then, but here, here he, and he's like, right, right. Winnick, I'm not admitting anything. We're just like, you're right. You're not, okay, okay. I'm still going he,

Collin Funkhouser  1:19:13

he humanizes this aspect, though, of like, why this made sense to him, because so, like, we get just like a little bit of feeling and emotion from Jaggers right now. This is the clearest, to me, like the clearest motivating factor of in a, in a, in all of this weird, twisted, warped sense of thing, he did this because all around him, he said, I put that case where he lived in an atmosphere of evil, and that he saw of children, and all that he saw of children was there being generated in great numbers for certain destruction. He often saw children solemnly tried at criminal bar, where they were held up to be seen and in. Habitually knew of their being imprisoned, whipped, transported, neglected, cast out, qualified in all ways, from the hangman and growing up to be hanged. He's basically saying, I did this. But hypothetically, if one were in this environment, they would do this to save the child. Yeah, when

Brandon  1:20:17

you only you're seeing children being punished and destroyed and and all this stuff. Like, wouldn't, yeah, it makes sense that a person would want to try to save one of the children.

Collin Funkhouser  1:20:27

And up until now, we don't like this again, this from like, a moral perspective, James is not a moral person or ethical person. He is by the law and by the books person, and here we have him opening up and speaking in an extremely personal way. Now this is his way of speaking in a personal manner. Winick would have his own way. And I love this aspect of like, okay, fine, hypothetically, yeah. Like, he still can't turn it off. He still can't not this. Just this made Jaggers an immensely. I love the Jaggers character all the more because of this little section of this. Now he's still not like a likable guy, obviously, for whatever reason. No, but like, I like, anyway,

Brandon  1:21:16

this, yeah, yeah, and so like, yeah, that's, yeah, that's basically, we get, basically, he's confirming everything that PIP fakes is true. Yes, he is right. Like he's not, he's not saying it, but he's saying it right. And so he's done this, but then at the end, he goes, All right. Now listen, yeah, put the case that the child grew up and was married for money, that the mother was still living, that the father was still living, that the mother and father, unknown to one another, were dwelling within so many miles, for Long's yards, if you like, of one another, that the secret was still a secret, except that you had got wind of it, right? For whose sake would you reveal that secret? Yeah, for the father's, I think he would not be much better. For the mother, I think she has done much indeed she would be safer where she was. For the daughter, I think it would hardly serve her. So basically, he's saying, Okay, congratulations, you figured it out. But to what end, right? He was like that, there's nothing you you should not do anything with this information, right? There's nothing that you can do knowing this won't help any of the parties involved, right?

Collin Funkhouser  1:22:45

None of them. And he says, You, you'd be much. You should chop off both your hands and have wimick Finish it for you. Yeah, you'd be better. It'd be better for you if you did that like this.

Brandon  1:23:01

Oh. And I just like he's I looked at wimick, whose face was very grave. He gravely, touched his lips with his forefinger. I did the same. Mr. Jaggers did the same. Now we make what item were you on when Mr. Pip came? Yep. And so he's like, they just kind of all agree to just Mum's the word Mum's the word you know. We're just gonna we know, or we're just gonna move on, because no good comes from knowing, yeah, you know. And then luckily, we get a distraction because Mike shows back up, poor Mike, and we see that at wimick and Jaggers, who were a bit looking each other side eyed, because he had found out that wimick has another side, and wimick had seen a bit of Jaggers exposed other side. Right now they are perfectly in sync again. Because he's like, Well, what do you mean? You're coming in here, and Jaggers is, like, tearing him up. And he looks at wimick, and he's like, What do you want about you are Rob come sniveling around here? Yeah, yeah.

Collin Funkhouser  1:24:17

Because the guy came in looking for help, because his daughter was picked up for, like, something, I don't know, theft or whatever. And he's like, tearing up about it. And then they both lay into him, like, don't you go bringing in emotions here? And how dare you. And then they're like, Yeah, same

Brandon  1:24:31

team, yeah. It's just very funny. Like, oh dear. And so he pips just, like, leaves. Like, he's like, okay, bang. Oh. Mr. Jaggers and women appeared to have reestablished a good understanding and went to work again with an air of refreshment upon them, as if they had just had lunch.

Collin Funkhouser  1:24:57

Oh, dear. Oh, man.

Brandon  1:25:01

Yeah, so, yeah, so, yeah. So, we now, we know. We do now. We know the full story of estella's parentage. We know who all these people are. Again, for some reason it matters, but it doesn't matter, right? Like, we know how all of the seven characters in this book are now connected. But, yep, I don't got it yeah, but I don't know why. Right To what end, right? What happens now? Are they still fleeing? Are they like, what is going on? So I don't really know what is going to happen here. Still, right? Yeah. To what end this has been discovered. I'm not sure what PIP is gonna do now. I'm not sure is he gonna Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. I literally don't know. Are they ever actually going to escape like I don't know what's going on was that seems to be like, continue to be hinted at as being some sort of important thing, but nobody is really taking any steps to like, make it happen.

Collin Funkhouser  1:26:11

Nope, nope. Nobody this is it's the slowest crawl right now, but you can see like we're taking the widest loop to get this all taken care of. That's for sure.

Brandon  1:26:25

Yes, that is 100% true. Like, it's the slowest burn of all time, like, but so I don't know, Yes, true. My question here before we leave is that we appear to have eight chapter. Is this true? Yes, yes, no. Do we want to tackle this in a like, 332, situation, or do you want to do four, four and no,

Collin Funkhouser  1:26:55

I don't know. I'm worried about these, these chapters, because they're so like, nothing happens, and then, like, everything happens, flaming Haversham coming in. Yeah, that's what

Brandon  1:27:07

I don't know. Like, and again, like, there's one short one just flicking, one longer one, the medium one, that one's kind of long too. Like, I didn't really know what you

Collin Funkhouser  1:27:18

I think we do three, three and two. I think, I think, because then we'll want to have some time. Well, I don't know how this thing is

Brandon  1:27:27

going to end exactly like, I don't know. That's what I don't know too. Like, is the last two chapters going to be like, bang? Like, is it going to be like, the pacing in this book is so insanely weird, yeah, that I don't Yeah.

Collin Funkhouser  1:27:42

Or is it gonna end in like, four chapters and then basically, like an Epilog for the last four? I say we just try 332, and we'll see that way that will give us our last, our last recording. When we do those two chapters, we're just gonna have to do an entire like,

Brandon  1:28:03

that's fine. Retrospective thing here. It's okay. That's fine. I just want to make sure, I just wanted to get your thoughts on that and see how. Because, again, the pacing, it might work out good. It might be fine. The but the pacing is so bizarre. It's like, what is going on? Perfect. So, all right, all right. Well, I do have a haiku for you right this week's. I couldn't help but base it on the book, because it was so jarring. So here you go.

Speaker 1  1:28:43

Okay, I'm ready. A flaming specter from the past reveals the truth, yet no one is freed.

Collin Funkhouser  1:29:02

Forgot. You, yeah, yes, you're good at this.

Brandon  1:29:15

I don't know about that, but I just like, we're so overcome by this actor. This is, like, all right, it has to happen right now. Like, yes, yeah.

Collin Funkhouser  1:29:29

Like, there's a lot in these. There's a lot to these. And I really want to know, like, how, oh, yeah, okay. I gotta know. I gotta know what happens. So well, we'll just, you know what. We'll just keep reading. That's what we're gonna do. That's all right, yeah, so we're gonna do oh yeah, cuz

Speaker 1  1:29:49

we totally Yeah, of course.

Collin Funkhouser  1:29:54

So we're doing this, doing this next time, and we'll see what the next three chapters. From Mr. Chuck here,

Brandon  1:30:03

literally, who knows, like, what? It's so great. It's so wonderful. And absolutely no idea what could possibly be happening.

Collin Funkhouser  1:30:14

I am so here for it. That's, that's the great part about it. I just It's so insane.

Brandon  1:30:19

So it is so insane. That's what. Like, I don't know, like, we're barreling towards the end, but like, I have no idea, like, how can this book possibly have any sort of resolution? I Yeah, like, that's what the that's the most bizarre part of this. Like, I've been saying that, like, the whole time, but now there's only eight chapters left. It's like, what is the end of this book? Yeah, it's just like, pimp looking out a window, being sad. Like, that's like, what is? I think

Collin Funkhouser  1:30:52

that's what we're gonna find. Think it's just

Brandon  1:30:54

like him, like, being distressed. Who knows who go?

Collin Funkhouser  1:31:03

Yeah, yeah. So that's yeah. I'm interested to see what gets resolved, what doesn't and what is still left open. And that's going to be maddening.

Brandon  1:31:15

I think surely, surely, nothing is going to be left like every single thing comes back around somewhere. Yeah, right. That's like, what's happening here? It's one of these.

Collin Funkhouser  1:31:27

Like, well, that means, yeah, we got some we got some Joe. Then that's gotta, yeah, we have to have some

Brandon  1:31:34

Joe, potentially bitty. Bitty is okay, Collin is Orlick making a comeback,

Collin Funkhouser  1:31:41

I think, yeah,

Brandon  1:31:43

is he gonna make an appearance somewhere

Collin Funkhouser  1:31:44

obvious? Yes, of course he has.

Brandon  1:31:47

Because everybody else keeps showing back up all the time, like and he's obviously, so we're gonna we do we need? Let's see, do we need closure for pumblechook? No, no, not really. We talked to him already, like, trying to think of other kid. No, that's pretty much it. So, like, we need Joe has to be here somewhere. Maybe bitty is also there too, I don't know. And then it the real question is, or, like, somewhere else in here, that's what we got? Yeah, that's what we're on the hunt for.

Collin Funkhouser  1:32:22

On the hunt for orley. On

Brandon  1:32:27

next time.

Collin Funkhouser  1:32:30

Thank you, yes, yeah, be our new sub brand here for this. So we'll so we'll do so next time, okay, love you, love you too. Bye. You.